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Philosophy


Debate Info

39
34
Yes, and my opinion is... No, and my reasons are...
Debate Score:73
Arguments:48
Total Votes:78
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 Yes, and my opinion is... (25)
 
 No, and my reasons are... (22)

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Nichole(689) pic



Do you believe this quote by Einstein?

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein

Yes, and my opinion is...

Side Score: 39
VS.

No, and my reasons are...

Side Score: 34
6 points

Finally, a famous quote (that I have never heard before) that backs up my sentiment perfectly! Religion and science go hand in hand. I've always believed that science answers the question "How does it happen?" and religion answers the question "Why does it happen?"

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
Bradf0rd(1428) Disputed
3 points

Science without X is lame science. Science seeks to answer questions through rigorous testing, trial and error if you will. This means, if you purposely deny any idea or leave anything out of the test you're not doing it right. Science without art is too, lame science.

Anyhow, Albert wasn't talking about christianity when he said this, or any typical religion of the time, he was speaking on more general terms. He was a scientific pantheist, which is to say, that he didn't believe in a personal god. "The idea of a personal God is quite alien to me and seems even naive."

You say that religion answers the why's, but Einstein also believed that there is no purpose in nature. Purpose (Intent) == Reason == Why. Pantheism revolves around existence and nature, so if a pantheist says that there is no purpose in nature, that means that God (equivalent to nature in pantheism) has no purpose in anything. God just is, as scientists typically believe the universe just is without a purpose or intention.

So what you get from this quote is actually incorrect. I'm not picking on your views, just differentiating between what he probably meant and what you're getting from it.

This is just funny:

"Why do you write to me 'God should punish the English'? I have no close connection to either one or the other. I see only with deep regret that God punishes so many of His children for their numerous stupidities, for which only He Himself can be held responsible; in my opinion, only His nonexistence could excuse Him."

-Letter to Edgar Meyer colleague January 2, 1915 Contributed by Robert Schulmann; also see CPAE Vol. 8 (forthcoming).

Einstein was a real badass.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
MKIced(2510) Disputed
1 point

Okay, you successfully pointed out that I didn't know the context of this quote, why Einstein said it, or even his personality for that matter. But I feel that the portion that was given should have been up for interpretation. So I may not have understood this part the way he intended for me to interpret it, but I still hold my beliefs. :)

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
2 points

Ya, that sound pretty logical. There's really nothing more annoying these days than a religious Christian who thinks science is "made up" and worthless.

So, if, religion answers the "why", what answers the "who." I mean, I've heard it over and over in other debates that people either say "God," or they actually don't care. But they care about the other questionable factors and somehow have the mindset to ignore the 'who.' I mean, if they're going to think that way, maybe they shouldn't think about it AT all, no what, where, when, why how.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
jessald(1915) Disputed
1 point

How does religion answer anything? It's just a made up set of beliefs. Why believe in one religion over another?

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

Science itself has become a religion. Is that too made up?

science itself does not answer anything. It cannot answer the basic question.

why are we here?

Where religion fails it does not consider the human intellect and inherent curiosity. But attempts to correct for this with a sense of morality and ultimate responsibility for our actions.

Where Science fails, it too does not consider the human emotion. but attempts to correct for this by applying intellect and reason.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
2 points

Absolutely I do.

Anybody that completely ignores science as a whole is retarded. And anyone who cherry picks scientific theories that back their opinion or make the life they want to live more convenient, without truly thinking about it are closed minded. But those people will never admit that they do that.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
1 point

Yes, also, with the fact that Einstein has an IQ of 500, I'm sure that most of the things he has said should be correct, if not to us, but then it's all about reality, though still, what he had mentioned was true. Religion has many interesting topics for Science to discover, without it, there shall be many limits binding an entire chunk away from science, due to the fact that there would be nothing much left for science to proof, plus if Religion kept it's belief without the reason why, and wether or not things are true, then of course, it's blind and ignorant towards any truth within' beliefs.- ;)

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
Filtereal(26) Disputed
1 point

But then that might as well be that it's because Einstein was more of a philosopher as well as a scientist, therefore, philosophy was what interested him the most into discovering so many things and getting so famous, though still, although as what I had mentioned, regariding the fact that there shall be many limits binding an entire chunk away from science, there are still many parts of science with MANY interesting things yet for mankind to discover, but then dicoveries without philosophy was not his main priority.- ;)

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

This is the way I see it. Religion (like it or not) affects our personality. It plays a key role in the development of a person's (or group's) value system. It has a profound effect on what we are curious about. Also what we are passionate about.

I am not inclined to study the context of the quote, but I believe it is unrealistic to discuss science and religion as being mutually excludable.

Religion influences what we study, Science consists of the most useful theories we have developed by applying the scientific method to those studies.

Side: You cannot seperate the two - methinks
1 point

The present state of the human mind should be recorded i history as mutch as goals attained in the period. That or we whould just have abunch of answers and no questions...all beit the remainder = winged vs horned men like it was possible to live forever not just in death! or a giant song sweeping across the universe played perfectly in key....why the hell did you come up with that without knowing about telekinesis and modern day physics? It leads too more intresting and meaningful conversations then the bluntness of reality in the first place....a blinde life is worth living...but do you realy wanna live it?

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...

Yes, this is true because it takes 2 to Tango. ;)

If God had violated the rules of nature, then everything would be magical. But just because there is no magic, does not mean that there is no God.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...

Yes, Einstein was religious despite his monumental discoveries in physics that being the Theory of Special Relativity and Theory of General Relativity. He tossed back and forth between what his believes were and what he was the research that he achieved.

READ: THE WORLD AS I SEE IT by Albert Einstein.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...

What is interesting about science is that people have confined themselves to studying because of religion. The contradiction of the two is what makes them both special. Science is interesting because Religion sometimes backs it up and sometimes wrongs it. The two are a great combination, they go together.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
1 point

Yes, I do believe in the quote. It creates a sense of perfect balance.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...

Well, Einstein was a genius so his quote is true. Einstein knew what he was talking about.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
7 points

Most people try to take a couple of quotes of his out of context to pretend he was a religious man.

I prefer this quote of his:

"The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this"

and this one:

""For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions. And the Jewish people to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people. As far as my experience goes, they are no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. Otherwise I cannot see anything 'chosen' about them.""

Then there's this one referring to the belief that he was religious

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

With the science without religion is blind quote, he didn't mean religion in the sense people are trying to pretend like it means. here is a quote which shows his definition of religion:

"Try and penetrate with our limited means the secrets of nature and you will find that, behind all the discernible laws and connections, there remains something subtle, intangible, and inexplicable. Veneration for this force beyond anything that we can comprehend is my religion. To that extent I am, in fact, religious."

The total extent of his spirituality was an admiration for the complexity of the universe. He did not like religions.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
ThePyg(6737) Disputed
2 points

although i agree that Einstein did not believe in a personal God and did not follow and religions and was basically an outright Agnostic, you got the quote wrong.

He said that Science without religions was LAME... not blind. He said religion without science was blind.

IDK if you read it wrong or wrote it wrong, but i just want it to be clear.

in fact, in the quote he was not saying that religion was right. He was just saying that religion becomes a sort of feeling that we create for something. A sense of explanation that goes beyond explaining.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
2 points

No Einstein was an atheist not an agnostic.

And yes I was just trying to quickly reference the quote and mixed it up.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
2 points

I don't believe that science without religion is lame. Science for the simple sake of empirically studying the world is a worthwhile endeavor in and of itself. I see no need to attach religion to it. There are, I will admit, large cosmological questions that science may never answer, but religion to me appears to be just as unqualified and unable to answer these as science has thus far been.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
Bradf0rd(1428) Disputed
1 point

The only problem with your argument (that I want to pick on) is that you assume that religion doesn't already answer every question man needs to know the answer to. Science may very well be off course, or lead humanity off course (in accordance with scripture).

The only reason you disagree is because you disagree with religion? According to scripture, empirical things were created by God, so studying only empirical things is just studying God's creations, and does have an ultimate goal, does it not? If Science is out to explain the unexplained, and religion is supposedly there to spread the word of God, the being that is Himself the explanation... What do you think would happen if Science successfully explained everything (impossible, I know)???

Anyhow, I agree with you, but I don't agree with your argument, per say. Almost every social science (including political science and psychology) deals with religion, so if you dismiss religion because it's not verifiable, you still have to deal with it as a scientist.

I don't think Einstein meant if you're a scientist you should be religious, and if you're religious you should be a scientist too... He just meant that they are inherently intertwined and one without the other it's true to it's nature... to explain.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
nigelc(49) Disputed
2 points

I don't assume that religion is wrong, I understand it to be wrong based on an empirical analysis of it using scientific methods.

The difference between our viewpoints comes in at the very core of how we view the world. Starting from scratch and building up a structure of knowledge, I assume scientific methods upon which to base evaluations and make decisions about the world. In light of this, I evaluate religion as generally being incorrect.

You, on the other hand, begin with an assumption that God exists, and religion is the path of knowledge. You then attempt to rectify this with science by pressing to two together (usually quite awkwardly), so that you will not be forced to abandon either, while attempting to follow both.

It is this initial choice in viewing the world from which our standpoints diverge.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
2 points

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein

Ignoring who really said what and how they said it, and what that person's beliefs really were, I'll just get to the actual point of what is being propogated.

Religion makes everything lamer, and only through science is the impotance of our imagination, no matter how wild we believe it to be, shown.

Example:

Religion defined stars as floating beings, or holes in some imaginary bubble. Wow, that's original...

This is what science has shown stars to be link

I find religion simplifies everything it touches, from people, to nature, to the cosmos. It labels all things black and white, when really everything is some shade in between. It either villifies or worships. It pretends to know the answers when there are none, and where there are, it claims there is no proof unless it's written in their book - no matter which religion one chooses.

Religion throughout history has worked to separate, in waves it says you are for us or against us, in one point in history crucifying, then when human nature is repelled by such ignorance, it sits on the sidelines, pretending to accept - really though, it only serves to divide and conquer or only conquer. Meanwhile, as scientists are killed for telling the world the sun does not revolve around it, or burned for suggesting it's not mystisism but elements which are the structure of the universe - it is always putting us in our proper place here, tiny, insignificant, and alone.

That we should be ironically what religion has said, that we should be shepards. But not for some invisible absentee landlord, but for ourselves, because we are the only ones who can truly lead us to greener pastures.

Religion was a necessary evil for a base and stupid people who had just realized they existed, and therefore someday would not. But I think of it as training wheels, and if we want to get anywhere, eventually we will have to take them off.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
2 points

Let me tell you a better saying: Science is lame without maths and Einstein is lame with everything.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

I wholeheartedly support this. Einstein was the founder of a religion and that's probably the reason why he (allegedly) said this.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

Im getting bored of arguing with people who take quotes from smart people out of context to ratify their dumb superstitions and never read the whole fucking thing. It is the same kind of people who only read the headlines off news and get outraged by them still. But what is there to do

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
1 point

See, I find issue with people who believe that religion and science go with each other like bread and butter. Religion is perfectly fine in my book, and I'm an atheist. I seriously love hearing about peoples belief systems and their positions. But though science isn't a religion, it very well serves the purpose of one. Threw theories and studies we find explanations to why things are what they are. Religion services the same purpose. So I have a hard time wrapping my head around someone explaining the universe two ways and saying they're the same.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

Science without religion is lame

Ha, maybe science without ethics is cruel, would be better- but it wouldn't be lame- unstopable-definitely. Science and religion are independant from each other, and they always have been.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

Religion be a motovator, but there are suitable motivator counter parts, also this quote is mistranslated, replace "religion" with "devotion" and you have a more accurate quote. And thus my opinion :D

Side: No, and my reasons are...
1 point

Science and religion have nothing to do with each other. Religion is one form of social organization, whereas science is the organization of learning and knowledge.

Side: No, and my reasons are...
flewk(1192) Clarified
1 point

I believe the quote might be referring to the purpose of religion and science, not the actual practice.

Side: Yes, and my opinion is...
-1 points

It's not even by Einstein.

And even if it is by Einstein, who cares. He wasn't a great person anyways/

Side: No, and my reasons are...